The Deep End With Lecrae

Dr. Anita Phillips spent 27 years married, went through a divorce, and still woke up the next day believing God is good. That's not a talking point. That's a testimony.
In this conversation, the NYT bestselling author of The Garden Within, trauma therapist, and lead pastor joins Lecrae for one of the most wide-ranging, deeply personal episodes of The Deep End yet.
They go everywhere. From her unlikely journey starting as a math and physics major, to why she'd rather have a spiritually open Hollywood than a religiously closed church. From why anxiety is actually a scarcity mindset, to the moment she was told in her PhD program that she was "misusing the Bible." From a deep breakdown of why the five stages of grief were never designed for survivors, to what it actually looks like to heal when you have every tool and still hit the floor.
Dr. Anita doesn't just bring frameworks. She brings receipts from her own life.
This one goes deep.
The Garden Within is available now wherever books are sold.
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Some of what you've said about me is right. I want to say which parts, specifically.
When Reach Records partnered with Phillip Anthony Mitchell and 2819 Church, it cracked something open — years of assumptions, questions, and criticisms about Lecrae that people had been carrying quietly suddenly got loud. So instead of guessing what people were thinking, he asked. Voice memos. Real questions. No prepared statements.
In this episode, Lecrae listens and responds in real time — to the secular collab criticism, the Cross Movement distance, the Reformed theology departure, the Warnock rally confusion, the people who think his music got watered down, and the Christians who've been watching him for 23 years wondering which direction he's really headed.
He also speaks directly to the people who are done with church but still craving community — and to anyone who's ever felt like they just can't win on either side.
No PR answer. No saving face. Just an honest one.
Topics covered:
Why the 2819 partnership brought everything to the surface
Secular collabs: missionary or compromiser?
Why he stepped back from Reformed theology circles
Cross Movement, the Ambassadors, and the bitterness he had to own
Growing up in public without a roadmap
"Die for the Party" and what it costs to be rebuked by the church
Mental health stigma in the church
For the 24-year-old stuck between the 9-to-5 and the dream
A public apology — and what he'd do differently
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📱Connect with us on Instagram! -   / deependlecrae
📱Connect with Lecrae - https://linktr.ee/Lecrae
Stream the Deluxe Album:   / reconstruction
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She grew up in one of the most famous families in American sports — and somehow didn't fully realize it until Deion's Hall of Fame weekend.
Deondra Sanders sits down with Lecrae to talk about growing up as Primetime's daughter, losing herself in a relationship, navigating a high-risk pregnancy, postpartum depression, a very public breakup, and what it actually looks like to rebuild when the whole world is watching.
She gets honest about the moment she got angry with God. About choosing to come back anyway.
Deondra Sanders is the eldest daughter of NFL Hall of Famer Deion Sanders. An entrepreneur, philanthropist, and athlete manager, she's built her own lane far from the spotlight — until life pulled her into the middle of it.
In this episode, Deondra and Lecrae cover:
Growing up as Deion's daughter and not realizing what that meant until she was 21
How a privileged childhood quietly killed her ambition
Losing herself in a relationship — and having to forgive herself for it
The pregnancy her family didn't take well, and why her dad surprised her
Postpartum depression: what nobody tells you, and what it actually felt like
The public fallout — what she wishes she'd done differently, and why she responded the way she did
Getting angry at God for giving her the blessing she prayed for the wrong way
Where she is now, and why she knows she's moving in the right direction

KB has been one of the most theologically sharp voices in Christian hip hop for over two decades. In this episode, he finally says what he's never said publicly — about his relationship with Lecrae, the tension inside 116, and the years it took to get to the other side of it.
This one goes deep.
IN THIS EPISODE:
How KB came to faith at 16 through a bootleg mixtape
The Flavor Fest moment that connected KB and Lecrae for the first time
What KB was carrying inside 116 that Lecrae didn't know about
The counseling session KB needed before he could tour with Lecrae
The South by Southwest text that nearly fractured the movement
Why KB felt Lecrae was over-indexing his mainstream reach
The tearful reconciliation — and what it took to get there
KB on reformed theology, race, and navigating Black identity in evangelical spaces
Why KB says the new generation of Christian artists is getting the victory without the cross
Contentment as a superpower — and why suffering is how you get it
KB's new album This Cannot Be Sold and what's next
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Step Into Reconstruction: https://reconstruct-u.com/
📱Connect with us on Instagram! -   / deependlecrae  
📱Connect with Lecrae - https://linktr.ee/Lecrae
Stream the Deluxe Album:   / reconstruction  
👕 Shop Lecrae Merch: https://lecrae.store/

Two days before this conversation, Sarah Jakes Roberts fractured her neck in three places jumping on a trampoline with her daughter.
Touré Roberts still showed up.
In this episode, Touré sits down with Lecrae hours after learning his wife wouldn't need emergency surgery — still processing the fear, still breaking down twice a day, still on a book tour. What he shares is raw, unfiltered, and completely different from anything you've seen from him on a stage.
They go deep on what it's really like to build a life and a ministry with Sarah, how Bishop Jakes' famous first question changed everything, and what Touré's new book Knowing: The Journey to Certainty in an Uncertain World has to say about finding clarity when everything around you is loud and uncertain.
Plus: the bullet that moved in his chest at 16, why he almost walked away from business to follow God, and the tension between being the man behind a rising force and knowing exactly who you are.
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Stay hydrated throughout your day. Use code lecrae for 20% off at dripdrop.com
Sign up for your $1/month trial today at shopify.com/deepend
Get 20% off your first order, plus free shipping during the Memorial Day Sale at BollAndBranch.com/deepend
_

Step Into Reconstruction: https://reconstruct-u.com/
📱Connect with us on Instagram! -   / deependlecrae  
📱Connect with Lecrae - https://linktr.ee/Lecrae
Stream the Deluxe Album:   / reconstruction  
👕 Shop Lecrae Merch: https://lecrae.store/