At the NATO summit on Wednesday, Donald Trump lashed out wildly at, well, everyone in sight. He threatened more war with Iran. He angrily vowed to cut off all trade with Spain. He hinted again at stealing Greenland. There were many other pratfalls. Amid all this, a Danish journalist had an extraordinary confrontation with NATO Secretary General Mark Rutte, asking him point blank: What does sitting next to Trump and praising him while he viciously attacks allies, threatens to take whole countries by conquest, and unleashes wildly destructive trade wars do to your “self-respect”? In an understated way, it was a crushing takedown of Trump, treating him as a ludicrous, sidelined figure while essentially saying: All that matters is how the rest of us react to this lunatic. We talked to foreign policy expert Elizabeth Saunders. She explains how deep and lasting Trump’s damage to the alliance will be, how our NATO allies are quietly managing Trump with flattery until he’s gone, and how they’re even trying to “de-Americanize”—that is, move on into the future without us.
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